old and new

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lukek
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Location: San Francisco, CA

old and new

Post by lukek »

4 days and only one new post? I am actully getting some real work done here. I do not want to inflate the Nasdaq again...!!!

I just came from a Ferrari of San Francisco tech session (I am attending the next two events to determine whether I want to renew my membership, it is a bit steep for a car club). Oddly enough, the dealership is not in SF, but across the Golden Gate Bridge in Marin. I have never been to an industrial park in such a picturesque setting, rolling hills, views of the bay, etc.. Not to mention that local incomes cause a 911 to be as common as pigeons at San Marco. It is like the new Camaro !!!
The GTE did well, despite lots of highway and missing its 5th gear. It just meant 75mph at 4000 rpm or so. I recently found a used overdrive unit and will pick it up when I go to Oracle AppsWorld in San Diego, right before the Superbowl.
At the club event, there were maybe 35 members and 20 F cars there. Other than my 250, there was only a 330 2+2 and GTC, everything else was Testarossas, and 3 series V8s in the parking lot. Inside, it was interesting to ogle several cars up on lifts. There were: A 355 sans engine, the last California Spider (its originality being criticized by a current FCA judge in the crowd), 2 brand new Maserati Spyders (why were they up? Haunting BiTurbo legacy?), and a 512M. Most interesting to me was a 360 Modena race car and a tour of the parts department (I was not allowed to take some of the Ferrari branded adhesive tape).
And as a general note....how times have changed. One of the chief mechanics had a 575M connected to a laptop, and he was changing gears by pressing the keys on the keyboard ! There is nothing you can do on these post OBD II cars if you are a hobbyist or an independent garage.
Imagine needing a 150K dollar diagnostic station and patented software to fix your car. I am happy with my "primitive" technology. This obfuscation and complexity mean that there is too high of a price to pay for reliability and modern conveniences, for me, anyway.
I am not a curmadgeon or a technophobe, I ship software for a living (althought I redesign it to be easier to use by mere mortals), but I only want one newer car in my house, and it goes "bye buy" as soon as the warranty is over. Maybe with time...I am told that half of the kids street racing Hondas have laptops where they can modify EFi setting and such before every run... Hmmmm....


luke
250 GTE
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tyang
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Post by tyang »

Hi Luke,

Thanks for sharing your experience. I too feel that the $$$ FCA membership seems to offer more "wine and cheese" than real gear head activity, especially for the owners of older Ferraris. I'd be curious to hear if you decide to renew.

I feel, however, that future restorers WILL hack into the OBDII ports, and work on their cars however it's required. It just takes a certain comfort level before people start working on the modern cars.

I'll stick to my old Ferrari. It's finicky enough without Italian computer engineering!

Tom
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lukek
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re: old and new

Post by lukek »

The OBD II hackers of tomorrow will be able to zap your car with a horsepower draining remote signal as they drive by. Write a chapter at the end of your book about this scenario (when is the restoration book getting published, anyway?). You seem to have a resonable talent for for dcumenting facts (the restoration), so you should try some fiction. You are in the entertainment business, right?
Tom Yang, the next BS Levy.

luke, in partly sunny, 60 degrees SF, CA.
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tyang
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Post by tyang »

Hi Luke,

I'm having enough trouble writing non-fiction! The book will probably be less a restoration guide and more of a story about my restoration. That's provided if I can actually do it!

Tom
racertodd
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re: old and new

Post by racertodd »

The "wine and cheese" aspect of FCA membership probably depends on which region you are in.

Here in the Northwest Region (Seattle, in my case) we have pleny of "gearhead" events.
Next month we're touring the Jon Shirley collection, one of several garage tours we do each year.
This is last year's Shirley tour: http://www.pureluckdesign.com/shirley/
This is last year's Pat Hart tour: http://www.pureluckdesign.com/hart2002/

A few weeks from now there's a dyno day at a local shop where we put the cars on a dyno and see what kind of power you're REALLY making.
We've had tech sessions with the local Ferrari guru, this Saturday we're going karting and we meet at a local pizza joint to view every F1 race.

Our activities probably reflect that the majority of our members are not pretentious rich guys that buy the cars to pickup chicks. (Apologies to any wealthy readers out there). Most of our active members are regular guys with a 308 or a GT4 or a dot.com guy with a 456. Guys who dreamed of owning a Ferrari some day and now have the money to do so.
racertodd
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re: old and new

Post by racertodd »

OBD II is being hacked already. In the Volkswagen world a guy has reverse-engineered the factory software.
For $200 you get a cable that connects your laptop to the OBD connector and software that will read and alter all the factory settings.

As todays complicated new cars age, I'm sure that there will be a market for OBD II software to work on them and that will lead someone to spend the effort to write the software to access the manufacturer-specific info that each car maker uses.

It will happen first on the high-volume cars, then work it's way down to the lower volume makes like Ferrari.

Todd
RallyVideo at: http://www.pureluckdesign.com/rallyyank/
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tyang
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Post by tyang »

Hi Todd,

I guess my biggest problem is the lack of enthusiasm for the Vintage stuff in FCA, but I guess there are always going to more guys with the newer stuff. (new being younger than '72!) It's also alot of money to join a club that doesn't have much to offer the Vintage owner.

Tom
Rob328gts
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Post by Rob328gts »

That's funny Tom, because us "3xx" owners feel like the FCA doesn't think we drive real Ferraris. Maybe FCA isn't doing it for anyone?

I met many walls 2-3 years ago when I joined the FCA and got frustrated. When the opportunity came up for me to take over the DFW chapter I jumped on it. We went from no events after the 2001 annual meet to over 25 planned for this year. My problem is most of those events are ones I'm directly involved in. I realize not all our membership wants to just do kart racing, track events, and happy hours. At least we're getting members out again and I hope we get some to start organizing concours and rally's, which I have no experience running.

Everyone knows how crazy I am about the vintage Ferraris, but I don't have one and until those owners step up to organize events or give me ideas, then it appears the DFW is not addressing the vintage membership.

http://www.fcadfw.com
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tyang
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Post by tyang »

Hi Rob,

Point well taken. My problem is what are you actually getting for $100+ dollars if it's expected that we do the work?

Tom
Rob328gts
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Post by Rob328gts »

Yes, the membership isn't worth the 4 times a year magazine. I also asked this same question because I was getting larger FChat local turnouts than the FCA. My question was why should I join and many still have that question. So far the only FCA benefits I've seen are inexpensive and good insurance for the driving events, FOD's involvement with the club by sponsoring events, and interaction with the non-internet Ferrari community (mostly the vintage crowd).

Otherwise we couldn't afford insurance, FOD wasn't involved with FChat, and the local FChat crowd was a narrow slice of the Ferrari community.
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tyang
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Post by tyang »

Hi Rob,

I used to be involved with Porshce Club for the Driver's Ed events, but at half the price for membership, it was easy to justify. Their local newsletter, AND National monthly magazine is a much deal. In Dallas, I can imagine the Tifosi to be hard to find, but in NY, there are plenty of us to get together without FCA.

The other interesting thing is the track events. The most fun I had was at the "Tri Marque Events" with PCA. That's when BMW, and Ferrari got together with Porsche club to do a Driver's Ed event. You really had a chance to see what your car could do with against the "competition!" I can cetainly stand in the Paddock and talk about how great Ferrari is, but it's nice to talk to owners of other cars as well.

This organization I found in the Fall that sponsers events at Lime Rock may solve the problem of insurance at the track, so there will be even less of a reason to join FCA!

Tom
Rob328gts
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Post by Rob328gts »

I agree with all your points Tom. I believe it's very expensive, but choose to pay for even the little I get back, just like the Ferrari Market Letter.

I think the best thing the Ferrari community has going for it is the free and efficient communication that takes place on here, FC, FL, and FF.
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lukek
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re: club

Post by lukek »

It looks like I will not rejoin. Some of the reasons for not doing so are based on my personal situation and type of car I own:

1. I do not have the level of confidence in my 40 year old to do track events with 360 Modenas. Rallies, yes, but not 7/10s track events
2. Club is not family friendly. Once, I wanted to attend the SF Zoo.Jazz event. Signing up was tough, as the coordinator asked me to prove that I was actually a member (I produced a cashed check for $125). After accepting my car for display at this limited event, he called me back 5 minutes later to say:
"I could not help overhearing a child in the background....You need to know that we do not allow children at the Ferrari / Zoo event"
Maybe this was a legal issue, but I declined to attend if people do not trust me to control my 2 year old (is he going to scratch somebody's Magnum Pi special, or will he drink too much wine? ).
3. The magazine is nice, not worth it for $135 (new fee for this year in N. CA). The adverts are online, too.
4. Almost every event requires an additional fee.
5. The Bay area is full of clubs, unofficial organizations, as well as opportunities to pick and choose one's events (ARA-alfa club, Autoexotica, Martin Swig's events, auctions, internet groups for marques and rallies).
6. I am not interested, nor do I have the time to go over my car with a Q-tip for the concours events. I like to drive mine, so this is somewhere between always cleaning it and always tracking it.

The club cannot be for everyone, so this is not a criticism that should be taken literally. I will probably rejoin if and when: I get a newer car, kids get older.

Besides, I already spent the money for club membership on an original 250 GTE brochure...

thx
luke
abrent
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Da Club

Post by abrent »

Hi Luke,

I think your decision to not renew is sort of sad in a way, but perhaps for reasons that you might not think. When I still lived in Manhattan Beach I too was a member of the FCA. We used it to attend events, the free ones, like drive days and special F1 viewing's, prefered parking at things like Rodeo Drive and to get into the Casa Munras in Monterey for the yearly carfest. Like you I balked at the price, but paid it anyway.

There are lots of "shunning" stories like your son at the Zoo event, more than I care to remember and pretty much all due to some over zealous member who made his/her own interpretation of what sort of people Ferrari people were. I thought it was bullshit, but have experienced it in both the Porsche Club and Aston Martin clubs so am a little more likely to brush this sort of thing off perhaps. Anyway, there is a point here... Somewhere, Oh yes.

Towards the end of my USA adventure I started going to the FCA local Club Board meetings, pretty much as an observer, but chucking in my opinion whenever asked. I can say without hesitation that the group administering the SoCal chapter are a great bunch. They react in horror, and fix things when missunderstandings occur. They have a hard time deciding, and debate, alot, about the type of events the membership would like. They have an interest in the old as well as new cars, many of them owning one of each, and seem to all be of the view that "who gives a crap, it's a Ferrari isn't it?" with enthusiasm at the chance of viewing any car, or including it in an event.

I guess my point is, if you have time -get involved and manipulate the local chapter to your needs. If not then enjoy the club for what it is, a group of Ferrari enthuisists who try their best to get a bunch of cars together.

Regards,

Andrew.
abrent
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DA Club

Post by abrent »

Oh, sorry, one other thing.

During the process of getting my car on the road I had frequent visits from a one Tom Meadows. He offered an interesting set of "personal Statistics" one day which could go along way to explain your lonelyness at the Ferrari SF event.

Off 955 GTE's Built, there are probably 500 left intact.
Of 500 intact, 200 might run.
Of 200 which might run, 120 are probably registered for road use.
Of 120 which can drive on the road, probably 50 will regularly.

In the world.

Congratulations on being one of the 50.

Regards,

Andrew.
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